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  • 35

Coroner: Asiana Airline passenger killed by rescue vehicle, was alive at time

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(CNN) -- Asiana Airlines Flight 214 passenger Ye Mengyan died of injuries she received from being run over by a fire department vehicle, and she was alive when she was hit, authorities said Friday. Police previously said she might have been hit by a fire truck after she was expelled from the crashed plane. (www.cnn.com) 更多...

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dbaker
Daniel Baker 15
Don't forget that the accident scene was covered in foam from the firefighters.
TXCAVU
Making it slippery. In fact she had fallen and was covered by the foam. No one could see her. If you recall, the SFPD reported this immediately and those involved in both trucks are receiving psychological trauma assistance. They have this to deal with for the rest of their lives so perhaps others could cease the negative comments.
whip5209
Ken McIntyre 11
Dunno about everyone else, but if I'd been on that plane (glad I wasn't) and walked away reasonably unharmed and the jet wasn't on fire, I would have gone back and looked around the plane for other survivors. It's my nature. I used to be a first responder.

I can't fault the firefighters, this is just a horrible misfortune. Smoke, debris, panic, confusion, vision restricted by equipment, rushing to save passengers still in the jet. The firefighters may not have known everyone was out. Don't rush to condemn. Anyone think they could do better? Try it some time.
JACKIETOOLS
JACKIETOOLS 6
I was NYPD for 9/11 before retiring. People like Mr. Fuquay probably have never been in, much less witnessed such calamity such as a plane crash and this being the case should not make joking and uninformed comments!
KevinBrown
Kevin Brown 4
I suspect the fact that the Pilots waited 90 seconds before starting the evacuation of the a/c played a role in this tragedy. Had they evacuated immediately after the plane came to a rest the passengers would have been clear of the wreckage when the fire rigs arrived on the scene. It probably never occurred to the firefighters that the a/c crew would wait a minute and a half to start the evacuation. No one should blame the fire crew for what happened.
skystore1
John Moffatt 2
I very seldom read comments on this site unless they can explain a specific technical point from someone who knows what they are talking about. I am totally disgusted that so many people would offer comments on what should have/could have/why didn't this or that happen when they WERE NOT THERE! There are so many stupid comments on this crash that I really don't believe the mentality of some people. Don't speculate. Wait until the EXPERTS(who are not a lot of you) investigate and release the findings. Have compassion for those involved and the families of those killed and injured and keep your inane comments to yourself!!
ptooner
It's a tragedy that this was published. No one needed to know that.
akayemm
Emergency procedures are easy to be framed, though based on experience, yet some thing can always go wrong.
Inadvertently. Like it or not.
Yes, in the present case too, like many of its predecessors, the procedures will be reviewed and improvements suggested will be enforced. Only to be reviewed/improved after the next mishap.
CPSL
Joe Mama 1
OK stop.............. it was a terrible situation all around. Blaming and shaming won't change a thing. Say a pray for all involved! Amen!
akayemm
Wait and watch, every woulda, shoulda, coulda, will be discussed qua all that was done.
And the 'wise' guys will come with a new routine, ONLY to be changed after the next accident! May be in 10 years' time or more, or less.
After all the drill followed on 6th July was based of some sets of knowledge based on past experience super imposed with new technology!
mreneb
C'était vraiment pas son jour !.........
akayemm
in plain English .... ??
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 1
It was really not his day.
sparkie624
sparkie624 2
That is the understatement of the decade :)
joelwiley
joel wiley -1
Swallow a frog first thing and your day is bound to improve.
If it doesn't, you at least have benchmarked a Really S***ty day!
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
I prefer swine, I'll go for Ms. Piggy instead...
joelwiley
joel wiley 1
BBQ or Luau style? I'll take either.
akayemm
ThanX, Buddy.
TXCAVU
Et, ce qui est arrivé avec vous?
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 2
Now I'm hearing that damn song in my head, voulez vous something avec moi!!!
akayemm
meaning ?
akayemm
Being rash and being in a rush - at times dividing line can be difficult. Especially if it involves 911 Services (emergency).
I wonder if some veterans of similar services can comment. I am sure that facing such a 'real' incident is once in a lifetime experience for any of these professionals of every description. I do not imply, by any stretch of imagination, any incompetence or callousness on the part of the rescue team/s
Hence too much of a postmortem is uncalled for as well unfair, at least from the members of this forum, both towards the victim's family and the rescue team involved including their families.
elmerfud1953
Jan Young 1
One thought, since the landing gear and tires were strewn about this entire area, what if it were one of those that struck the passenger as it was crashing and coming apart?
whip5209
Ken McIntyre 1
No, didn't happen that way.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
This is very tragic, but things happen.
mwf117
What a sad day. Makes one sick to your stomach.
RobSJC
.. And it's stories such as this .. as to why, I DO NOT and WOULD NOT ever post crash secne photographs on ANY website, my own or with consent of some one else.
joelwiley
joel wiley 0
I see this as a case of tragic collateral damage. Plane on fire, high probability of souls still aboard, fire suppression high priority, lots of surrounding debris, etc make the event understandable.

I wonder if the autopsy report will identify injuries that occurred before the firetruck arrived. It is possible that such injuries would have been non-survivable. We probably will never know.

Rest in Peace Ye Mengyan
akayemm
The persons involved in the post mortem, identify ALL injuries, separate the fatal ones from the non fatal type, to fix the cause/s of death. For example, that is how murders are distinguished from ordinary homicides, and all that.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
I am sure they did not do this on purpose... This is very tragic... Sometimes people get hurt in the line of duty, and sometimes innocent bystanders get hurt.
akayemm
A simple example. Cross fire between forces and terrorists/armed criminals, in public area. Civilian causalities are not impossible.
TXCAVU
Autopsy report did identify the injuries and they confirmed the injuries reported by the fire dept.
KennyFlys
Ken Lane -2
This got to be one of the saddest deaths involving an air accident.

I hope it changes procedures in how crash crews approach the scene with "eyes outside" and not just driving toward the mass of metal.
jimcander
Jim Anderson 0
What do you suggest, first responders drive slower? It was an unfortunate accident. Period.
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 2
No, being more observant around the scene of the crash.

During emergency procedures, are you slower and methodical or do you rush through things?

Stop and wind the clock.
jimcander
Jim Anderson 1
Let's see... twin aisle goes down. You see survivors walking around. You need to get there ASAP. The prospect of someone being covered/hidden by firefight foam has never been discussed. What's your focus? Slow down? They'd have been vilified for that. It was an accident.

I am not a trained emergency first responder. How do I respond in a emergency? No idea. Hope I never have to. Monday morning quarterbacking this is just not appropriate.
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 1
I'm not talking about dragging their rears to get there. I'm talking about not simply rushing into the immediate vicinity as is so often done. I am talking about much more observation by multiple sets of eyes while approaching the scene.

This will most certainly change how crews approach a scene.
preacher1
preacher1 2
There is gonna be a whole lot of 20/20 hindsight, shoulda, coulda, woulda, posted here. Fact remains is that a girl is dead, a tragic ACCIDENT, something those responders will never forget and something that will be in the back of every responders head from now on. I'd say that is going to be better prevention procedure than could ever be written or trained for.
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 1
I agree. It is indeed tragic and I cannot imagine the feelings of those drivers moving the trucks.

As I said below, it needs to impact training with foam... something they currently do not do. That is completely separate from the death of the girl.
jimcander
Jim Anderson 1
As mentioned elsewhere in the thread. You're 15 feet in the air. Your focus is getting to the scene. What exactly are you looking for? Obviously, you seem to think there is something they should have seen. What?
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 1
Somehow, someway, a body was missed and covered with foam. How did that happen?

Her body was found near the left wing though she was seated in the back of the plane. She was under a layer of foam.

Were they so anxious to spread foam over a fuel spill to ignore what was under the area being covered? Did they not observe larger pieces of wreckage and differentiate from what may have been bodies (dead or alive)?

One of the things I noticed in my reading is they do not train with foam because of environmental impact. That needs to change. I don't know how they'll deal with it but they need a solution to see how things change with the use of foam.

I have no doubt it was chaotic and rushed. I've seen that just in firefighting drills on an aircraft carrier. Yes, it is different between a drill in training and the real thing. Your mind operates differently and adrenalin is more at play. But the goal is to minimize the difference in reaction and quality of reaction between training and real scenarios.

You can't do that if you're not training with the same materials and similar circumstances to a real crash.

As for your last questions, "Obviously, you seem to think there is something they should have seen. What?" I can't help but think they were so anxious to spread foam they failed to observe what they were spraying on.
preacher1
preacher1 1
One thing that must be remembered also, not only the drills, but the multiple responses they will make in a weeks time to a declared Emergency, then, after 12 years or so, here is the real thing, with no forewarning. Mell of a hess.
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 2
As indicated, I believe a major issue here is not training with the materials at their disposal.

To have foam but never train for it, how can they know its characteristics? How can they know it reacts to outside influences and factors?

But this action resulting in death really boils down to not observing the area carefully before spraying the foam. This was not the first crash where bodies were ejected from the wreckage so something was certainly missing from training.
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 2
As indicated, I believe a major issue here is not training with the materials at their disposal.

To have foam but never train for it, how can they know its characteristics? How can they know it reacts to outside influences and factors?

But this action resulting in death really boils down to not observing the area carefully before spraying the foam. This was not the first crash where bodies were ejected from the wreckage so something was certainly missing from training.
jimcander
Jim Anderson 0
What where they anxious to spray foam on?????????? A flaming airplane that may still pax on board. That is much more highly an occurrence than having an eject and alive pax somewhere among the debris.

You will never, ever be able to drill the real thing. The first responders involved an all involved will remember this. That is sufficient in my book. I don't want them second guessing themselves.

You're the expert here. Whats a body look like covered in foam as opposed to piece of the fuselage?
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 1
You forgot a question....

What did the area look like before they sprayed with foam? What were they spraying foam on?

Was it indiscriminate just for the sake of suppressing any fire danger? Or did they look carefully at each area before spraying foam?

Given they never train with using actual foam or similar material, I suggest the former.
jimcander
Jim Anderson 2
Before when???? What the hell are you talking about???? Before the crash? Ever been to SFO? It's brown, burned grass between the runways. What do you mean what did it look like before???? What does an ejected body look like? What does crumpled fuselage look like? Good grief....
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 1
Okay, you're making your argument having read very little. You're trying to make an argument while missing out on a lot of reported facts.

I've given a few of them to you in my prior posts. You're not picking up on them.

I'm not here as a flight instructor where I should have to lead you to resources. You should already be seeking them out of you're going to comment on a subject.

So, I'm done with this. I have a business to run.

Have a good day.
jimcander
Jim Anderson 0
I read your "facts." You state where she was found and where she was seated. Fine. How about making a point? What are you inferring? Since you never make that statement, I cannot respond to your statements other than to defend the actions of the first responders which you are calling into question.
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 1
I made my point; more than once. You seem to have missed it.
jimcander
Jim Anderson 0
Yes. Procedures should be changed. Slow down. Be careful. Two things that make zero sense given the gravity of the situation.
banksiaman
Ken makes a valid point. Procedures failed .Review procedures
akayemm
Er.A.K. Mittal -3
Is this karma for both, the deceased and the truck operator/s ?
I am an Indian(Hindu), and most of us believe in this.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 2
I kinda believe in fate, but it shouldn't be questioned in something like this...
akayemm
I am no scholar of Indian scriptures, please note.
Fate and Karma are synonyms of each other, in certain ways!

[This comment was deleted.]

THRUSTT
THRUSTT 7
By the way your ignorance is showing, you obviously can't be Hindi, because it is a language!
TXCAVU
mikeap,want attention? You are flat out rude, ignorant and an embarrassment to yourself.
antokalaz1
No need for that here in this forum.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 2
I believe you're an asshole!!!
preacher1
preacher1 2
Get him, boy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
chetanya
chetanya 2
true that
BERspotterDE
Michael Laue -6
I thought, they'd train this several times a week ... obviously not :o/
Or don't they have any real people to rescue on their exercises?
jimcander
Jim Anderson 1
Volunteering to be covered and hidden by firefighting foam so they can't see you for the next drill?

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

joelwiley
joel wiley 6
Fly the airplane comes to mind as an immediate answer to your question.
Av8nut
Wow! A lot of negatives here. I guess I have to explain myself a little clearer. I was asking more from an operational standpoint, if we should expect there to be put in place more systematic procedures (ATC clearance, taxiway clearances) for emergency responses, if they are not already in place.
preacher1
preacher1 1
The negative comments are not really pointed at this comment but the one that you made below

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

Ltgadget
Joseph Mule 8
Michael. Ever sit in a fire crash truck? Picture being 15 ft in the air center console surrounded by equipment. It's not like driving your car you ignorant fool. You are obviously not involved in emergency services. Your comment makes me sick. That firefighter has to live with the fact he accidentally killed someone.
chicoaggie
Tim Smith 8
dude, seriously? you have to joke about this? the firefighters were there to save lives, i would assume there would be copious amounts of smoke that perhaps prevented them from seeing her. or maybe she was covered by debris. way to be a human Michael Fuquay...
preacher1
preacher1 7
I got to chime in here with the rest of them. Regardless of whether you were joking or being sarcastic, it's piss poor taste. It definitely wasn't intentional and as Joseph said here, that firefighter/responder will have to live with that the rest of his life.

[This poster has been suspended.]

HunterTS4
Toby Sharp 2
He get's it man, I'm tellin ya!
Pileits
Pileits 5
Mr Fuquay, do you understand why you are being FLAMED in here? If not you should!

[This poster has been suspended.]

Av8nut
I did pass English class though.
preacher1
preacher1 1
o-o-o-o-h. Wrong guy to smart off to. Your ass is bad in the mud now. He happens to be especially grumpy right now, due to a painful medical procedure over the weekend
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
Hope it wasn't a visit to a procto or uro...
preacher1
preacher1 1
uro-kidney stone
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
How long do they keep u out of flying after that
preacher1
preacher1 1
Don't know; I think it will depend on the medication and you personal, with the pain.

[This poster has been suspended.]

Av8nut
Yes, I am sorry that my remarks have offended others. I obviously crossed a line that should not have been crossed. I exploited the usage of a public forum for a callous remark that should not have been said. Again, I am sorry and will try to think before I type in the future.

James801, if it kidney stones you're battling with, I wish you a speedy recovery, as this something I dealt with years ago and wouldn't wish them on my worst enemy.
preacher1
preacher1 2
I don't know about the rest, but for me personally, I will say apology accepted. It obviously was a learning experience for you and we have all been there at one time or other. All part of life. Blue Skies
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 1
I had surgery after a second gall stone a few years ago. I was told that pain is close to that of child birth or worse. I had a renewed fondness for opiates.

I was out of flying for only a couple weeks. Morphine made up for some of it.
TheFasterGun
Faster Gun 1
I've had 17 bouts with kidney stones.
Had lithotripsy on the second to last because it had my left kidney blocked, it was 10mm in size.
The last one, last may was big enough to require lithotripsy again. This time I woke up with a hard, black, catheter sticking out of the end of my dick. it had a leash on it and went all the way to my bladder.
One learns to identify the symptoms of kidney stones early and flush them out.
Beer, watermelon, and plain old water are your friends.
Don't be a pussy, man up and handle them.
TheFasterGun
Faster Gun 1
Y'all know I am kidding about the don't be a pussy remark, right? The first bouts with kidney stones had me whimpering like a baby...
Av8nut
Wow! A lot of negatives here. I guess I have to explain myself a little clearer. I obviously was not being serious about this post. A comment like this is more of a knee-jerk response to most automobile accidents. Obviously, this driver was so focused on getting to the plane, listening to radio transmissions in the truck, and no doubt, had lots of debris in the area to get around.

[This poster has been suspended.]

akayemm
Bravo, well said!
Av8nut
Yes, I am sorry that my remarks have offended others. I obviously crossed a line that should not have been crossed. I exploited the usage of a public forum for a callous remark that should not have been said. Again, I am sorry and will try to think before I type in the future.
akayemm
It takes a brave and upright man/woman to apologize, so publically!
Well done.

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