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Unvaccinated Americans Could Soon Be Barred From Entering The EU

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International air travel is slowly returning, but virus cases are also on the rise again. Therefore, the European Union is mulling over plans to soon introduce restrictions such as quarantine and testing for those traveling from additional countries if they are not vaccinated. (simpleflying.com) 更多...

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musephoto
Geoff Rowe 3
It is important to understand that this is not a vaccine in the way the general public accepts the term. This is a brand new and experimental technology which is being “field tested” on billions of people.

I’m not entirely comfortable with that concept and neither am I comfortable that if, in 1 year, 5, 10, 15 years time a percentage of those who’ve had the “jab” develop strange illnesses or auto-immune responses.

It’s not like the pharmaceutical industry has a glowing record on producing perfect drugs, is it?
bentwing60
bentwing60 3
And on this one they have demanded and been awarded a "federal waiver of strict liability"!

Meaning, after it harms or kills you or your kids, you have no legal retort and they are indemnified!

My new definition of hypocrisy, "The Hippocratic Oath".
Cleffer
Cleffer 2
This is one piece of information a majority of the public fails to see. "It's been tested for decades!" they decree. Uhh, not on humans it hasn't. This type of "vaccination" has never been tested on humans prior to this public roll-out. I would even (admittedly) speculate that they use the term "vaccination" as a blanket of comfort to the general public so it's lumped with the other vaccinations we're safe and comfortable with and have been taking for decades with very little issue. As you pointed out, this vaccination is a very different type than those, with no human testing verification. For those that are aware of this fact, I can understand a bit of speculation. There's no one that will answer your questions in ten years when you end up having problems.
andyc852
Andy Cruickshank 4
What I fail to understand is "What is the downside of getting vaccinated?" If the vaccine improves my chances of staying out of the hospital and off a ventilator I view that as a great trade off and one that potentially helps others. I am vaccinated and other than asore arm after the second shot have experienced no ill effects. I am willing to be enlightened
ghstark
Greg S 7
Vaccines have risks, some very serious. It's that simple. That's true of every vaccine, not just COVID. The benefits of a vaccine must outweigh the risks, and some people feel that they are at extremely low risk from the disease and would rather not take the risk of the vaccine. In addition, the Covid vaccines have obviously been tested less than any other vaccine ever offered to the public.

There has also been an extensive campaign of misleading and outright fabricated claims about the risks of the Covid vaccine by the usual band of conspiracy theorists. The result is a significant percentage of people are afraid of the vaccine. They don't avoid the vaccine because they're resisting being told what to do, they're genuinely afraid. It's the few loud and proud resisters that you read and hear about on the news, but the vast majority of the unvaccinated are simply afraid, perhaps somewhat irrationally.

Unless you believe the CDC is cooking the numbers, the overwhelming evidence is that the risk of Covid for most adults is vastly greater than the risk of the vaccine.

So what do you do? The Robert Cowling's of the world believe that what you do is mock the unvaccinated for being stupid (because no one is as smart as Robert Cowling) and threaten them with all manner of government sanctions including, as Robert has said, putting them in "camps". I think you should respectfully try to convince them with facts, not fear, of the good sense of getting vaccinated. Imposing travel restrictions on the unvaccinated is probably not worth much in terms of disease control but it's the kind of things governments to avoid criticism that they're not doing enough.
Cleffer
Cleffer 3
Holy crap. A rational, well thought out response.

Then there's some of us out there who almost died from the virus (six days in the hospital in March of 2020) and have had tremendous success traveling and living among the infected (NOTE: All quarantine periods and testing were met per my business requirements because common sense dictates that.)

I have not tested positive once out of the dozens of tests I've had since then. I've flown 36 times. I had coworkers in the office who tested positive in the summer of 2020. My immune system appears to be doing it's job. I am not carrying the virus or I would test positive prior to my trips or on return.

If I were to get COVID again, I would seriously consider the vaccine, but until then, I trust my immune system to continue doing it's job.

This is MY experience.
MJReardon54
Matt Reardon 2
Yes of course, The vaccine generates just one antibody to the spike protein. Actual infection with the whole virus activates not just one antibody but the entire much more complex cascade of immunologic response. There are many more than just one type of antibody, there are surface IgA antibodies, there are specific antiviral killer t-cells that get activated, there are many antiviral chemicals that the body produces with natural infection. The live virus elicits a much much more robust immune response than this very simplistic vaccine. Much of this more robust response remains at the ready for potential re-exposure. This is exactly one reason to justify the alternative shocking proposal that if this virus had been allow to take its natural course things could not possibly have been overall worse that they have been and we all would lagely be through it all by now and have saved ourselves many trillions of dollars and forfeiture of many of our most basic rights and freedoms.
MJReardon54
Matt Reardon 1
THisw is the 21st century, it is a post hoc fallacy to assert that because many who currently have covid pneumonia were not vaccinated that that itself proves that EVERYONE needs to be vaccinated. First of all this relates to why case-control studies are low on the totem pole for validity assessment of clinical recommendations, it is subject to high levels of bias and improper attribution. But also since this IS the 21st century it should have already been determined WHY these relatively few particular individuals out of the 100 million or more not fully vaccinated ended up getting the pneumonia. We should have by now developed very pricise demographic, phenotypic, and genotypic risk profiles that could be used to determine individual risk. If that was done, if that had been done, we would almost certainly be able to vastly limit the vaccination recommendation to a much smaller percent of the general population. If you are an MD you surely must understand this. THis approach is entirely possible but this is one of the problems will not allowing much less encouraging dissenting viewpoints, viewpoints not tainted by government burocrats and media up to their chins in and esperately defending their immediatedly established and preconcieved agendas. BTW i of course am vaccinated because it was forced upon me. As for you or any others whether you get vaccinated or not could not possibly be of any benefit or harm to me, it is your decision (or maybe not), you have the right to choose. It is unethical for MDs to be forcing medical treatments on the unwilling for whatever high-handed reason.
bentwing60
bentwing60 1
https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/fda-issues-warning-about-increased-risk-heart-inflammation-caused-moderna-jab
MJReardon54
Matt Reardon 0
Perhaps too subtle for you : there are many many ways to arrive at a lie. Misrepresentation, disceptions, casing data in convenient ways to support preconceived programmatic positions, relentless propaganda, application of governemtal power, willful or through ignorance the application of dozens of the many fallacies of improper reasoning, succumbing to anything that alleviates fear which more often that not is irrational and due to ignorance of complex often paradoxical mechanisms, a trust in the most superficial and often wrong levels of validation (case in point masking has literally face validity and thats about it except for plastic manaquins and rodents in a box where it works extrordinarily well). Lying by governments and institutions is an artform, Governments and media are lying machines and their lies are complex but all directed at achieving their agendas which for government is power and control and for the media is attention and aligning opinions to what the backroom editors and producers want people to think and do.
patpylot
patrick baker 4
barring the unvaccinated is absolutely the required first step . Barring such americans from domestic flights would make good sense too, and do the carriers have the fortitude to do the correct thing at this time? This virus seems to be like the iceberg for the TItanic: the never-vaxers believe in unsinkable ships, the rest of us stayed awake in science class and got some common sense insights about living on a planet where many dangerous things are too small to see without microscope. The anti-vaxers don't know what end of the microscope to peer through, nor do they comprehend what they are observing.
cfreeflight
Caleb Helmuth 0
I’m sorry you have your head in the sand.
jeffinsydney
jeff slack -4
surprised you could pop your head from the sand to write that comment, yes you Caleb
Dubslow
Dubslow -1
Plenty of scientists dissent with the current popular thinking. Don't make the mistake of believing that the CDC represents scientific consensus -- it very much does NOT.
bentwing60
bentwing60 -4
Based on your obvious tolerance of the plights and viewpoints of others, would you have declined a C17/C5A ride out of Kabul? Most were unvaxxed, unmasked and not US citizens. Nothing quite like reasoned, fact based knowledge to present a rational, cogent defense of ones position. None of which is present in your diatribe. Your petulance is palpable. ammo up,karen
mmhumble
mmhumble 3
I still have antibodies a year after having COVID-19. According to several studies, I'm more protected than those from the vaccine.
emkostiuk
emkostiuk 1
I had my annual physical on Aug 6 and found out the exact same thing. I never knew that having had COVID and survived that I was protected.
jmilleratp
jmilleratp 2
jeffinsydney
jeff slack 2
For those of you old enough to remember; scroll to the next comment.

Up until about 1976 WE ALL travelled with a vaccination booklet in the back of our passports.
If you did not have one you were not entering any country and not leaving your own, including the USA.

This helped the world bring Cholorea, TB, Typhoid and other diseases to extinction.

Just what is all the fuss?


International Certificate of Vaccination or Prophylaxishttps://bookstore.gpo.gov › products › international-cer...
Known popularly as the Carte Jaune or Yellow Card, this is the international certificate of vaccination (ICV) approved by the World Health Organization.
ghstark
Greg S 2
None of cholera, TB, or typhoid is extinct or even anywhere near extinction.
andyc852
Andy Cruickshank 0
Here was me thinking this was an aviation related site not a place for wannabe public health experts
bwrightak
Bob Wright 1
Good I hope they are when are people going to get the point that it takes all of us to stop this virus Jesus won't do it for you.
markaharris
Mark Harris 1
If you haven't been vaccinated you shouldn't be allowed on any commercial flight - period.
MJReardon54
Matt Reardon 0
The more important point is that if you bother to look at the data in the vaccine inserts themselves, the number who got covid in any form (most mild) in either or both study arms was tiny as it is in the general public. Hence the 'protective benefit' of NOT getting the vaccine is about 99% whereas in the arm getting the vaccine its about 99.5%. The benefit of getting the vaccine is miniscule, and we will see in years going fwd that these initial vaccine effectiveness numbers were biased and not nearly as high as advertised currently. That approx 0.5% difference mostly acrues to not getting mild or inconsequential covid. That is the reality. However if your reality of covid is based on watching TV news where it is highly sensationalized or you are one of the intractably narcissitically neurotically fearful then of course you have a different perspective. And sure some of my relatives and coworkers (all required to and complied with masking) had it (me a resolute nonmasker, never got it and never will), all were minor cases that in any prior cold and flu season would not have been mentioned, my brother died due to covid fanaticism and wrongful intubation, a coworker continues to be afflicted with ICU PTSD b/c he too was improperly hospiralized and vastly overtreated. There most definitely are many legitimate and very critical viewpoints WRT this idiotic situation involving covid which is far more about grotesque public health errors, very wrong public health approaches, vastly overstating the effectiveness of this vaccine, not even considering the distinct possibility that masking actually promotes the risk of pneumonia, etc etc. What many of you desire is just like the government, have no dissenting opinions.

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